Unraveling Divine Justice: A Theological Review of ‘Morning Sermon’

[00:09:32] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_06]:
Here we go.
[00:09:43] Good morning again.
[00:09:45] Thank you so much.
[00:09:47] I'm Monica Humple, the Associate Pastor of Engagement.
[00:09:51] If you didn't hear me before, I want to say good morning to you.
[00:09:53] Again, welcome to our 9.30 worship service.
[00:09:56] Welcome to those of you in person and those of you online.
[00:09:59] We're so glad that you're here.
[00:10:01] Curious questions again today.
[00:10:03] Another really good one that we had.
[00:10:05] like what we had last week but we're gonna go a little deeper today I'm excited for you to to experience that if you are new to us here at Williamson's Chapel hey we are so glad that you're choosing to worship with us today if you are newer both those of you here in person and even those of you who are new to watching us online not only a very special welcome to you but a special invitation after worship today if you have a moment we would love love love for you to stop by what we call our
[00:10:33] Connection Station which is just outside of the doors in the patio area don't worry we have an umbrella I know it's bright but it's a beautiful day we have a nice pitcher of ice water if you're thirsty we got you covered we even have a gift for you just for being here with us today we would love to meet you in person and to give you a special welcome in person and just to get to know you and give you a chance to get to know us if you have any curious questions about Williamson's Chapel
[00:11:00] Now's the time to ask we want to answer those questions for you so join us after worship at our connection station and hey if you can't stick around for whatever reason you got to get heading out to go to brunch or whatnot we have a QR code right here on the screen if you scan that there's several buttons right there on the page the very top button will take you to a form where you can fill that out tell us about you ask your questions and I will happily email you all
[00:11:27] all the answers that you're looking for and hey those of you who are not new remember this QR code is for you as well it tells you everything going on in the life of the church this is your one-stop shop I hope you'll take advantage of that all right friends it is a beautiful day outside and even a more beautiful day inside because we are here to worship the God who loves us so much so let's continue to worship together

[00:12:01] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_02]:
Church, when you stand up, let's worship together.
[00:12:16] Here we go.
[00:12:21] Come all ye thirsty, come to the well that never runs dry Drink of the water, come and thirst no more
[00:12:37] Come all you sinners, come find His mercy Come to the table, He will satisfy Taste of the goodness, find what you're looking for
[00:12:59] The world that He gave us His one and only Son to save us Whomever believes in Him will live forever
[00:13:35] All your failures bring your addictions come to the down at the foot of the cross Jesus is waiting there with open arms
[00:13:54] For God so loved the world that He gave us His one and only Son to save us Whomever believes in Him will live forever The power of heaven forever
[00:14:19] I'm walking in freedom for God so loved, God so loved the world Praise God, praise God For whom all blessings flow Praise Him, praise Him
[00:14:46] For the wonders of His love Praise God, praise God From whom all blessings flow Praise Him, praise Him For the wonders of His love
[00:15:12] For God so loved the world that He gave us His one and only Son to save us For God so loved the world that He gave us His one and only Son to save us Whoever believes in Him will live forever
[00:15:48] I'm walking in freedom for God so loved, God so loved the world Bring all your failures, bring your addictions I made them down at the foot of the cross Jesus is waiting there, we'll open arms

[00:16:25] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_05]:
Sometimes things happen and the screen doesn't work right, but maybe God was trying to tell us something.
[00:16:30] God so loved the world is what was stuck on the screen.
[00:16:33] Maybe that's what we needed to hear about all of that.
[00:16:36] God so loved the world and He's waiting with open arms.
[00:16:40] And that is the truth, church.
[00:16:42] So we come this morning gathering over questions.
[00:16:45] You see these question blocks up here in the front and a pile of Bibles all stacked up.
[00:16:52] Some of us came in here, depends on your age.
[00:16:54] So this looks like a little bit of Mario that you're going to jump up and hit that.
[00:17:00] if you're too young or not of that age group of Mario you won't get that but look at the questions think about the ways that you have been wondering about things in faith in life there's a lot of things that i wonder about and i know you do too we put our questions in this summer and now we're having the opportunity to hear our preachers share about it in worship services and devotional time all through the week thinking about those things that just pull us that we're like
[00:17:28] God, why is this happening?
[00:17:31] Who gets to go to heaven or hell?
[00:17:34] All these questions that we have in our heads.
[00:17:36] I think one is, why did God make mosquitoes?
[00:17:39] Which is a valid question, I feel like.
[00:17:41] I feel like that is.
[00:17:43] So, I'm inviting you to think about that.
[00:17:45] My name is Carrie Wright.
[00:17:47] This is our worship team here at Williamson's Chapel.
[00:17:49] We are so grateful that you are here joining us in worship.
[00:17:53] Will you hear these words for just a minute?
[00:17:56] Just reflect for a second.
[00:17:58] You asked and now we're going to answer.
[00:18:00] Faith is full of questions and far from being evidence of the lack of faith.
[00:18:05] These questions represent our true wrestling with God about who God is, about who we are as children of God and how we live faithfully.
[00:18:15] And this fall we'll be answering your curious questions and we invite you to join us in a spirit of openness, humility, and curiosity as we allow ourselves to consider some of the harder questions of our faith as we grow as disciples of Christ.
[00:18:32] Our next song is Bless God and during that time we're going to take up the offering we have the privilege to give back to God some of the blessings that we have been given and so I hope that the ushers will come with their baskets and pass it and I hope that you will think about all the ways that God has blessed you all the ways that this church has been able to bless in the community and to share the word of God
[00:18:55] and to give back to God generously as we continue in ministry with each other and with God.
[00:19:03] The song Bless God means, the writer of the song says, we're going to bless God no matter what happens.
[00:19:11] We're going to bless God when amazing things happen.
[00:19:15] When I get a bonus at work or a promotion or I get an A on that paper
[00:19:20] Or when all things are going good or when I can see the fruits of my work as parenting and my kid does something great.
[00:19:28] But they're also going to bless God when my friend gets cancer.
[00:19:32] We're also going to bless God when our marriages are maybe not quite where they should be.
[00:19:38] We're also going to bless God when we lose somebody that we love.
[00:19:42] We're going to bless God in the amazing things.
[00:19:45] We're going to bless God in the hard things because God is right there walking every single step of the way in this space and where we go outside in the world.
[00:19:56] I invite you to join with me and bless God.

[00:20:20] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_03]:
All those who run to Him Who place their hope and confidence in Jesus He won't forsake them Blessed are those who seek His face Who bend their knee and fix their gaze on Jesus They won't be shaken
[00:20:45] Come on and praise the Lord with me.
[00:20:53] Sing if you love His name.
[00:20:59] Come on and lift your voice with me.
[00:21:16] Blessed are those who walk with Him Whose hearts have said a pilgrimage with Jesus They'll see His glory Blessed are those who die to live Whose joy it is to give it all for Jesus And for Him only
[00:21:42] O Jesus, all for your glory Come on and praise the Lord with me Sing if you love his name Come on and lift your voice with me
[00:22:22] Sing if you've known His grace Come on and lift up your holy hands He's worthy of all praise
[00:22:42] Bless God in the sanctuary Bless God in the fields of plenty Bless God in the darkest valley Every chance I'll get I'll bless your name Bless God when my hands are empty Bless God with the praise that calls me Bless God when nobody's watching Every chance I'll get I'll bless your name
[00:23:09] Bless God when the weapons fall on me Bless God when the walls are falling Bless God cause he goes before me Every chance I'll get I'll bless your name Bless God for he holds the victory Bless God for he's always with me Bless God for he's always worthy Every chance I'll get I'll bless your name
[00:23:39] Every chance I'll get Come bless your name Every chance I'll get Come on and praise the Lord with me And sing if you love His name Come on and lift
[00:24:05] Let your voice with me It's worthy of all our praise Come on and lift
[00:24:30] Of your holy hands He's worthy of all our praise Yes, He's worthy of all our praise Amen.

[00:24:54] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_05]:
Amen.
[00:24:55] Church, you may be seated.

[00:25:02] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Good morning, church.
[00:25:05] Our scripture this morning comes from the Gospel of Mark, chapter 9, verses 42 through 48.
[00:25:14] So I invite you to take a deep breath.
[00:25:20] Let us hear God's word.
[00:25:23] If any of you cause one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for you if a great millstone were hung around your neck and you were thrown into the sea.
[00:25:35] If your hand causes you to sin, cut it off.
[00:25:38] It is better for you to enter life maimed than to have two hands and go to hell, to the unquenchable fire.
[00:25:45] And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off.
[00:25:48] It is better for you to enter life lame than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.
[00:25:53] and if your eye causes you to sin, tear it out.
[00:25:56] It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and to be thrown into hell where their worm never dies and the fire is never quenched.
[00:26:05] This is the word of God for all people.

[00:26:08] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Thanks be to God.

[00:26:09] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Awful cheerful, isn't it?

[00:26:12] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So last week we left off, right?
[00:26:15] You remember we talked about how Jesus said, I am the way, the truth, and the life.
[00:26:18] No one comes to the Father except by me.
[00:26:20] And we challenge you to think about how we understand what that means in a different way.
[00:26:27] We challenge you to think about Jesus is the way that God saves us.
[00:26:33] It's Jesus' faithfulness that saves us, not ourselves.
[00:26:38] And we challenge you to, when you're wondering about who's going to heaven, to start with maybe yourself.
[00:26:44] And being mindful about the kind of witness you're sharing about the love of God and the ways that you're praying for other people.
[00:26:51] And one of the things I said there at the end was that I think that telling people they're going to hell is lousy motivation.
[00:26:57] It's not great discipleship.
[00:26:59] And Wes said that we should put a pin in it.
[00:27:01] So I'm going to take the pin out.
[00:27:03] And I'm going to ask you, oh great Bible scholar...

[00:27:07] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Taking a pen out, that sounds like a grenade.

[00:27:09] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Well, I mean, you know.
[00:27:11] And tell us a little bit about hell in the Bible.
[00:27:14] I'd love to.
[00:27:16] You'd really love to?
[00:27:17] You've just been sitting around all week thinking you want to talk about hell?

[00:27:19] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
I have been sitting around all week thinking about hell.
[00:27:22] Okay, all right.
[00:27:22] It's been my week.

[00:27:27] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Keep talking about it.
[00:27:28] Here we go.

[00:27:30] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
So, the amount of attention...
[00:27:32] that a lot of people give to hell and in my opinion the overly confident claims that many Christians make about hell or who is or will be there it's not proportional to how little attention it actually receives in scripture and that reminds me about the confident claims we were supposed to go over the rules weren't we

[00:27:54] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Oh yeah, rules.
[00:27:55] Quick.
[00:27:56] Real quick.
[00:27:57] The rules.

[00:27:57] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Next slide, I think.

[00:27:58] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
I don't know if it's on the slides.
[00:28:00] No, that's not it.
[00:28:01] Go back.
[00:28:02] So, the rules.
[00:28:04] We're going to approach this with humility.
[00:28:06] So, everybody take a deep breath.
[00:28:07] You don't know everything.
[00:28:08] I know that's uncomfortable for some of you.
[00:28:10] You don't know everything.
[00:28:11] It's okay.
[00:28:11] So, we're going to approach it with some humility.
[00:28:13] We're going to stay grounded in God's Word, not in what we heard some preachers say to us one time.
[00:28:18] Because you've heard a lot of preachers say a lot of stuff about hell, my guess is.
[00:28:20] Some of you more than others of you.
[00:28:22] and we're going to trust God in the wrassle.

[00:28:26] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
The wrassling.

[00:28:27] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
The wrassling.

[00:28:28] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
So, go ahead.
[00:28:29] Good, thank you.
[00:28:30] So, about that humility piece.
[00:28:34] The amount of overly confident claims that many Christians make about hell and who is or is not there doesn't really match up to how little attention it receives in Scripture, so we're going to look at some numbers.
[00:28:44] I did some number crunching.

[00:28:46] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Wow, that's impressive.
[00:28:47] Sorry.

[00:28:48] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
It's the only time I look at numbers.
[00:28:51] So from the New Testament, here's the thing.
[00:28:53] In the Old Testament, the word hell does not appear at all.
[00:28:56] The word hell does not show up in the Old Testament at all.
[00:28:58] The word there is Sheol.
[00:29:01] You might think of the underworld.
[00:29:03] It's kind of like the land of shadows.
[00:29:04] It's like Hades in Greek mythology.
[00:29:08] So that's in the Old Testament, Sheol.
[00:29:10] But the word heaven is used in the New Testament 276 times.
[00:29:16] including how Matthew uses that.
[00:29:18] Matthew doesn't say kingdom of God and Matthew Jesus talks about the kingdom of heaven.
[00:29:23] We'll come back to that point in a little bit.
[00:29:25] So 276, the word save or salvation is used 132 times.
[00:29:33] By comparison, the word translated as hell is only used 13 times.
[00:29:40] And three of those are repeats that Matthew and Mark, same stories in Matthew and Mark, use the word hell.
[00:29:49] The word condemn or condemnation related to God's judgment or to the end of life or end of the world is used ten times.
[00:29:57] The word punishment is used eight times.
[00:30:00] And the word wrath is used 29 times.
[00:30:03] So all those what we would consider negative words, that's a total of about 100 times compared to heaven 276 and salvation 132.
[00:30:12] That's definitely balanced in one direction.
[00:30:17] It's out of balance to the good when it comes to Scripture and how often those words are used.

[00:30:25] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Okay, so that feels disproportionate to how much we've all heard about hell, right?
[00:30:29] I don't know about you all that feels disproportionate to me about how much like does it match the percentage of time that some people spend talking about hell and judgment and it for sure does not match the number of sermons that I've heard that you might want to put in the category of hellfire and brimstone right that were scary or calls to turn or burn um I think what you hear about you'd think that what we we from what we hear that it would be more than that it's just interesting so what are we supposed to take from it what are we supposed to get out of that it's interesting facts

[00:30:59] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
The New Testament is far more interested in the hope of heaven than the threat of hell and more focused on salvation than condemnation.
[00:31:09] Even more importantly, the New Testament is way more interested in how we live in the reality of God's kingdom in the here and now in our everyday lives than what happens after we die.
[00:31:19] Go back to Matthew using the phrase kingdom of heaven.
[00:31:23] He says kingdom of heaven instead of kingdom of God.
[00:31:26] because Matthew was writing to primarily a Jewish Christian audience who would have been really uncomfortable saying the name of God.
[00:31:35] So Matthew's kingdom of heaven.
[00:31:38] The kingdom of heaven is not some far off place or some far off reality.
[00:31:43] The announcement of Jesus, what Jesus preaches and announces is that He's bringing God's realm, the kingdom of heaven, here to earth and we live into that now.
[00:31:52] So it's not that use of kingdom of heaven or heaven language.
[00:31:56] It's really about how we live in the reality of God's kingdom now in our lives.
[00:32:02] So...
[00:32:03] Wait a minute.

[00:32:04] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Oh, okay.

[00:32:07] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Hold on.

[00:32:10] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Go ahead.

[00:32:11] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
To be clear.
[00:32:13] Hell and judgment are all mentioned in the Bible.
[00:32:17] So we cannot nor should we ignore them.
[00:32:20] However, we should not be obsessed with them or live in fear, be overcome with fear when thinking about things like hell and judgment.
[00:32:30] Okay.

[00:32:31] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So I can ask my question?

[00:32:32] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
You can ask your question.

[00:32:33] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So I feel like you're telling me Belinda Carlisle was right that heaven is a place on earth.

[00:32:37] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Thanks for that earworm.

[00:32:39] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
You're welcome.
[00:32:40] You can think about it all day long.

[00:32:41] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
I'm sure I will.

[00:32:43] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Go ahead.
[00:32:45] Sorry about that.
[00:32:46] Yeah, you have a...
[00:32:47] I'm supposed to say something?
[00:32:48] Yeah, you have another question.
[00:32:49] So, when Bible says hell, I'm guessing you know what that is in the Hebrew or the Greek.
[00:32:55] I feel like that... Who else feels like that's something he would know?
[00:32:59] That's for sure something you would know.

[00:33:00] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Certainly after this week of preparing this sermon.

[00:33:02] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So, why don't you tell us what hell means in the Bible?
[00:33:04] When it does say the word hell, what is the word, what does it mean, and how are we supposed to understand that?

[00:33:08] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
The word Jesus uses for hell is Gehenna, and there should be a slide up there.
[00:33:14] Gehenna, which comes from the Hebrew Gehenom, which means Valley of Hinnom.
[00:33:20] If you go to the next slide, that's the Valley of Hinnom today, or Gehenna.
[00:33:25] Does not look very hellish, does it?

[00:33:28] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
I mean, I kind of want to go take a picnic.

[00:33:30] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_07]:
It looks very nice.

[00:33:31] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Now, actually, there were other pictures, literally, of people taking picnics in Gehenna.

[00:33:38] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
That's kind of funny.

[00:33:39] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
It's a valley to the southwest of the Old City, of Old Jerusalem, right beside what is known as Mount Zion.
[00:33:47] So it's kind of on the southwest corner of Jerusalem.
[00:33:52] Gehenna, or the Valley of Hinnom, was a location for the ancient Canaanite worship of Molech, which included ritual child sacrifice using fire.
[00:34:09] And that's mentioned in 2 Kings, 2 Chronicles, and Jeremiah.
[00:34:14] And so after the ancient Israelites took possession of that territory, they turned what was the site of the worship of Molech into a garbage dump, which sounds like a pretty good way to use that location.
[00:34:30] So they turned Gehenna into basically the town dump for Jerusalem and surrounding areas.
[00:34:37] Now, it's traditionally thought that the waste thrown into the Valley of Hinnom or Gehenna was burned.
[00:34:43] More to the point, it was a trash pit that continually burned.
[00:34:48] Maybe today we would call that a dumpster fire.
[00:34:50] I don't know.
[00:34:52] But that's a good indication what it might look like.
[00:34:57] Maybe less plastic, but go ahead.
[00:34:58] Less plastic, of course, if you want to update what Gehenna would look like.
[00:35:01] And when I was a kid...
[00:35:05] Growing up, we didn't have, where I lived, we didn't have trash service.
[00:35:07] So, you know, we didn't have roll the trash to the curb kind of stuff.
[00:35:10] So, every few weeks, I'd have to get my dad's truck and load up the garbage, primarily in the summer, load up the garbage and take it all the way up to Salisbury to the dump.
[00:35:19] And you can imagine after, if I was a slacker, which I was, I would wait a couple days too long, and you can imagine in the heat of the summer how that trash smelled.
[00:35:31] So imagine that, multiply that into a large valley of waste.
[00:35:37] And so you get the sense that sulfur, what we talk about sulfur, the fire and brimstone, kind of that overwhelming smell of sulfur.
[00:35:47] Think about how trash would smell burning it constantly.
[00:35:51] There's that odor.
[00:35:52] And then now to kind of really
[00:35:55] That kind of pushed that image to where Jesus was using it to kind of make it hit home.
[00:36:00] Now think about if it was constantly burning what it would have looked like at night.
[00:36:03] Go to that next image.
[00:36:05] It would have been worse at night.
[00:36:08] So think about the heat and the smell and then there's no other ambient light.
[00:36:12] It's just smoldering fire.
[00:36:16] Down in Gehenna.
[00:36:17] In Gehenna.
[00:36:17] Now that's a pretty terrifying image, right?
[00:36:20] Pretty overwhelming.
[00:36:22] The impact of that image for the people Jesus was talking to is pretty clear, I think, and it kind of gives some oomph to that image of Gehenna.
[00:36:34] I don't think it's meant to describe some conscious, eternal state of perpetual torture, but to indicate the destruction of those who willfully reject God's love,
[00:36:45] or live in ways that are greedy or selfish or hateful or lacking in hospitality for strangers.
[00:36:52] For more information on that, I'd suggest you go read what Jesus says in Matthew 25 about the sheep and the goats.

[00:36:59] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So when we think about hell, like in my head, I've always had, you know, the dude with the pitchfork and the horns, right?
[00:37:06] And he's down there like, you know, the Far Side Gallery would tell you that he's like, you know, you're like doing paperwork all the time.
[00:37:12] But anyway, but the dude with the horns, that's not like biblical?
[00:37:16] Like there wasn't a pitchfork guy down there doing his thing?

[00:37:19] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Stirring up trash?

[00:37:19] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Stirring up trash, no.
[00:37:21] The pitchfork would make sense in that case, I would think.

[00:37:23] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Pitchfork would make sense in that case, but that's not biblical either.
[00:37:26] There's no actual, no detailed description of hell in the Bible.
[00:37:32] We see, described as fire, a place of burning, but there's no, like, for as much as Christians have talked about it historically, you expect, like, chapters to be devoted to what hell is like, but that's just not there.

[00:37:45] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So, but there is, the Satan is there, the Satan.

[00:37:50] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
We ain't got time.

[00:37:51] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Okay.

[00:37:52] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
I gotta keep focused.

[00:37:53] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So the devil is real, though?

[00:37:55] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
I mean, yes.

[00:37:57] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
But it's not to do with the pitchfork.

[00:37:59] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Not to do with the pitchfork.
[00:38:01] Much of what we think about when we think about hell.
[00:38:03] A lot of the imagery we use, including the devil with the horns and the pitchfork.
[00:38:07] A lot of that might have some connection to Scripture way back, but most of that comes from Dante's Inferno or the writings of Milton.
[00:38:18] In our time, Hollywood.
[00:38:21] So a lot of movies and things like that.
[00:38:24] There's a helpful quote from a theologian named N.T.
[00:38:26] Wright, and he says that once Christian readers had been sufficiently distanced from the original meaning of the words, meaning once they had kind of lost that association with Gehenna, alternative images would come to mind generated not by Jesus or the New Testament, but by the stock of images, some of them extremely lurid, supplied by ancient and medieval folklore and imagination.
[00:38:51] as time went on more images into this concept of hell so the concept of hell like back to we're back to this whole being fear not being a great motivator right so it doesn't seem like a good one to me and that's not biblically speaking what it would have been either is that what you're saying right so the command many of you've heard me say this the command that god gives to people and to us more than any other command in all of scripture is fear not do not be afraid
[00:39:17] and the fear and condemnation fear of condemnation and fear of hell has been used throughout the history of Christianity really as a way to control people and it's been used in some very unhelpful ways you know fear is a great short-term motivator right fear fear of something will will kind of force us into action
[00:39:42] It's like if there were a spider right there, would you be...
[00:39:48] It would provoke me to leave.
[00:39:49] Yes.
[00:39:49] Fear is a great motivator, or a snake.

[00:39:52] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_07]:
I would not stick around.

[00:39:54] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
So, motivation in the short term, but fear is a lousy motivator.
[00:40:00] In the long term.

[00:40:00] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
In the long term.

[00:40:02] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Because you have to keep stoking that fear.
[00:40:04] You have to keep over and over again.
[00:40:06] It's just not good, and that's not what God wants for us.
[00:40:10] That's not the abundant life, the peace, the joy that God wants for us.

[00:40:17] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So, the questions that everybody was actually asking was, at least if the concept of hell, if not a physical place, hell, is biblical.
[00:40:27] So the concept of a Gehenna is a biblical thing, and there being
[00:40:34] You know, some place where the refuse is thrown, right?
[00:40:39] That is biblical.
[00:40:40] But the question really everybody was asking was, is it populated for how long and who's in it?

[00:40:46] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
I don't know.
[00:40:49] But you want more than that, right?

[00:40:50] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
I really do want more than that.
[00:40:53] So, can you help us?
[00:40:54] I can help, I think.

[00:40:55] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Okay, so there are three kind of common ideas or conceptions of hell in Christianity, and I want to be clear about this.
[00:41:03] There is no one official view of hell in Christianity.
[00:41:08] Each of the three views I'm getting ready to talk about have been held by a number of different Christian leaders, theologians, pastors, and thinkers.
[00:41:16] Your salvation
[00:41:19] is not in any way connected to or predicated on what you happen to believe about hell.
[00:41:26] I think you should say that again.
[00:41:28] Your salvation has nothing to do with what you think about hell.
[00:41:32] I can't imagine standing before the throne of God, standing before God's judgment, and then God saying, you didn't get this detail about hell exactly right, you're going to hell.
[00:41:45] That does not sound like the God we see in Scripture, does it?
[00:41:48] The God revealed in Jesus.
[00:41:51] So if it turns out I get to heaven and I was wrong about the nature of hell, I'm pretty sure God's grace will cover that too.
[00:42:01] So here are the three primary ways Christians have understood or talked about hell.
[00:42:06] The first one I've already mentioned kind of in passing really was eternal conscious torment.
[00:42:14] That sounds terrible.
[00:42:15] Do we have that slide with three options up there?
[00:42:17] I thought I sent it.

[00:42:18] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_07]:
Maybe I didn't.
[00:42:19] Maybe you didn't.
[00:42:19] Maybe I didn't.
[00:42:20] It sounds like something you didn't do.

[00:42:21] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
It does sound like something I didn't do.
[00:42:23] Eternal conscious torment, which is exactly what it sounds like.
[00:42:27] So hell is a place where people go and they're tortured for eternity and they're aware of it every second.
[00:42:33] That's really kind of the view that has been the most prevalent in Christianity.
[00:42:38] The second one is called annihilationism.
[00:42:42] that also sounds pleasant which means that hell there's no eternal conscious torment but those who are in hell are destroyed obliterated annihilated they're just they no longer exist and then the third view is basically universalism that if there is a hell it is empty and that or there may be no hell that God saves everyone universally
[00:43:11] Now, I think that's the one we should want, right?
[00:43:16] Do we want everyone to be saved?

[00:43:18] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Sure.

[00:43:18] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Does God will, does God desire that everyone should be saved?
[00:43:23] Certainly.
[00:43:24] I lean towards that second option, Annihilationism.
[00:43:28] I'll tell you why in just a second.
[00:43:29] I don't believe in that eternal conscious torment because I don't think it's consistent with the character of God revealed in Jesus Christ.
[00:43:38] And I don't think it reflects a careful reading of Scripture.
[00:43:41] And I also don't think it's just.
[00:43:45] If we believe that God is just, we get, what, a few decades of life here on earth.
[00:43:50] And if we then, I don't think that matches up with an eternity in hell.
[00:43:57] It just doesn't square with me.
[00:43:59] But I'm humble.
[00:44:01] I'm one person and a finite human being and all that stuff.
[00:44:06] I don't believe in universalism either.

[00:44:08] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_07]:
Sorry.

[00:44:11] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Should I believe in universalism?
[00:44:13] No, I was just coughing.
[00:44:15] Sorry.
[00:44:15] I don't believe it.
[00:44:16] Also because of Scripture, as well as the nature of authentic love, love must be freely chosen in order to be authentic.
[00:44:27] You can't force love.
[00:44:30] It's not love.
[00:44:31] That means someone
[00:44:34] Knowingly or willingly rejecting God's love is a possibility.
[00:44:39] Someone knowingly cutting themselves off from God, from the source of life, that's a possibility because of the nature of love.
[00:44:46] Bishop Will Willimon says that John Wesley, the founder of the Methodist movement in the 1700s, Willimon says that Wesley taught universal redemption, complete atonement for all,
[00:45:00] Through the work of Christ on the cross, yet Wesley also knew that some tragically refused this gift.
[00:45:05] So Wesley taught that whereas there is in Christ universal atonement, meaning that Jesus died for every person, there's enough grace to go around, there may not be universal salvation because not everybody will choose that gift of life.

[00:45:23] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So that makes me think about the vine, right?
[00:45:25] John 15.
[00:45:25] That's what I'm thinking about as you're talking about that.
[00:45:28] Like this whole concept of the source of life and God being, like cutting ourselves off from the source of life and what happens when we do that.
[00:45:37] And John 15, Jesus talks about that because we do actually believe that how we live matters, right?
[00:45:42] You know that.
[00:45:43] How you actually live actually matters.
[00:45:46] And how we live in connection with God matters.
[00:45:49] And our faithfulness, that matters too.
[00:45:52] Oh, you're getting the Bible.
[00:45:53] That matters too.
[00:45:55] And last Sunday we talked about how we're not saved by our faith, but by Jesus' faith.
[00:46:00] So, the question I get to is, what does our faith do then?
[00:46:04] Like, what's the purpose of my faith?
[00:46:07] Why should I have it?
[00:46:08] And it seems to me it has to be more than about avoiding hell and punching our ticket to heaven.
[00:46:13] That commitment to faith is very important for our salvation, and while it doesn't save us when we die, I think it might be something more about how it changes how we live.

[00:46:24] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Do you agree with that?
[00:46:25] I do agree with that.
[00:46:26] I love that you picked another I am statement.
[00:46:29] We talked about this last week that
[00:46:31] In John, Jesus has these statements.
[00:46:34] He says, I am the... Way, the truth, the life.
[00:46:37] Way, the truth, the life, and I am the vine.
[00:46:39] So I'm going to read John 15.
[00:46:42] It should be on the screen too.
[00:46:44] It should be on the screen.
[00:46:44] Good.
[00:46:46] Well, that helps.
[00:46:46] I don't need this.
[00:46:47] I mean, I do need the Bible, but just not right now.
[00:46:50] I am the true vine, and my Father is the vine grower.
[00:46:54] Oh, I almost fell down.
[00:46:55] He removes every branch in me that bears no fruit.
[00:46:57] Every branch that bears fruit, he prunes to make it bear more fruit.
[00:47:02] You have already been cleansed by the word that I have spoken to you.
[00:47:06] Abide in me as I abide in you.
[00:47:09] Just as the branch cannot bear fruit by itself unless it abides in the vine, neither can you unless you abide in me.
[00:47:17] I am the vine you are the branches those who abide in me and I in them bear much fruit because apart from me you can do nothing whoever does not abide in me is thrown away like a branch and withers such branches are gathered thrown to the fire and burned if you abide in me and my words abide in you ask for whatever you wish and it will be done for you my father is glorified by this that you bear much fruit and become my disciples as the father has loved me so I have loved you
[00:47:48] Abide in my love.
[00:47:49] If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love, just as I have kept my Father's commandments and abide in His love.
[00:47:56] I have said these things to you so that my joy may be in you and that your joy may be complete.
[00:48:02] This is my commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you.

[00:48:09] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Okay, so there's a vine.
[00:48:14] And God's the vine, according to this passage.
[00:48:16] We're not the vine, God's the vine.
[00:48:18] God's the vine, we're the branches that come off of that center vine structure, right?
[00:48:24] And that means, what we're trying to say there is that God is the source of all life.
[00:48:29] Like a vine described by Jesus, and we're the branches, and if we want to live, we have to remain attached to the vine.
[00:48:35] Okay, so I'm going to remind you that I went to the School of Science and Math, and that I remember just a little bit of what I learned in science.
[00:48:43] Slightly nerdy.
[00:48:43] Just a little bit of a nerd.
[00:48:45] Okay, so dust off the misty recesses of biology 101, friends.
[00:48:52] If you remember, in biology you learned that the nutrients come through the connection to the roots.
[00:48:58] Right?
[00:48:59] That's how that works.
[00:49:01] And plants have vascular tissue like we have vascular tissue.
[00:49:05] And there's two sort of sets of vascular tissue.
[00:49:08] One is called the xylem and the other is called the phloem.
[00:49:11] And I'll learn that.
[00:49:11] Xylem up, phloem down.
[00:49:13] Okay?
[00:49:13] So xylem, the xylem carries the nutrients, the water, the
[00:49:18] Everything that is needed for the plant to thrive transports the water up through the vine into all the branches.
[00:49:25] That's what that does.
[00:49:26] And then the phloem transports all that sugar that's developed because we have leaves that collect, you know, you remember all that stuff.
[00:49:34] Anyway.

[00:49:36] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Go ahead, though.
[00:49:37] It's fascinating.

[00:49:38] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Anyway.
[00:49:39] So you have the leaves and photosynthesis happens and it produces sugars that the plant needs to grow and those go back down through the phloem, okay?
[00:49:47] And so that's how the leaves grow and it's how the sun helps plants to grow.
[00:49:52] And so if you cut off the connection, the xylem and the phloem, the branch just stops existing.
[00:50:01] It's just cut off.
[00:50:01] It can't get any nutrient.
[00:50:03] So like if you were to, you know,
[00:50:05] Remember that time, Wes, when you were at First Methodist High Point and that kid took a zip tie and wrapped it around his wrist and pulled it real tight?

[00:50:13] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Right at the start of worship.

[00:50:14] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Right at the start of worship, right?

[00:50:16] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Like, what do I do?
[00:50:16] Like, you shouldn't have done it in the first place.

[00:50:18] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Anyway, but what was going to happen is you were going to cut off blood supply, right, to the hand, and that's not good.
[00:50:24] I'm looking at Jenny.
[00:50:24] That would be bad.
[00:50:25] That would be real bad, right?
[00:50:27] And you don't want to do that for a long time because eventually what's going to happen is your hand's going to die.
[00:50:31] Because it's not getting the nutrient it needs, right?
[00:50:34] So the same is true for a plant, right?
[00:50:36] If you restrict the ability of the xylem and the phloem to do their thing, the plant's going to die.
[00:50:41] That's what's going to happen.
[00:50:42] So we need to remain connected to the vine for life and for fruit to grow in us.
[00:50:47] And if we cut ourselves off from the vine, which is what we call free will.
[00:50:52] Okay, this is why I'm a Methodist, y'all.
[00:50:54] I believe in free will.
[00:50:55] I don't believe, you know, remember Aladdin, you know, the genie can't make people fall in love because that has to be a choice, right?
[00:51:04] Free will is a thing.
[00:51:06] So if we cut ourselves off from the vine, we sever those connections that are bringing us nutrients and water and help the fruit in us to grow, then we cannot live.
[00:51:17] If we sever the xylem and the phloem, that part of the plant will die.
[00:51:21] And in this little analogy, what we're trying to say there is that literally apart from God, we can't do anything.
[00:51:28] Literally apart from God, we can't do anything.
[00:51:30] It's not like when you cut off the branch, you throw the branch into the fire like this said, it's not like the branch burns forever.
[00:51:38] Is that what happens?
[00:51:40] Branch doesn't burn forever.
[00:51:41] Eventually it's gonna like be consumed.
[00:51:44] Right?
[00:51:45] That's the whole point of burning it, right?
[00:51:47] Is you're trying to get rid of it.
[00:51:50] So the truth is we can cut ourself off from the source of life and that's what free will is and when we do that we just cease to be.
[00:51:57] And friends it's not so much condemnation as consequence.

[00:52:02] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
I like that.
[00:52:03] It's not condemnation, it's consequence.
[00:52:04] I bet you didn't expect to hear a lot about xylem and phloem in a sermon about hell, though.
[00:52:09] So we like throwing occasional curveballs.
[00:52:10] Cheers.
[00:52:12] So it's not so much about what God does to us.
[00:52:16] And I like what you're saying about the vine and the branches, and it connects to what John the Baptist says.
[00:52:21] What does not bear fruit is cut off and thrown into Gehenna, or thrown into the fire, where things just cease to be.

[00:52:29] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So what's no longer connected is thrown out.
[00:52:32] It's not like the branches are cut off and they writhe on the ground forever in some sort of eternal conscious torment, right?
[00:52:39] They just are inert and lifeless.
[00:52:41] So think about, you trim your bushes, right?
[00:52:44] And that stuff is just, it's not like it's...
[00:52:46] It's suffering, it's just dead, right?
[00:52:49] And there are a lot of questions from you all about how God, is God going to punish us forever?
[00:52:55] And I don't know, the first thing I would want to say about that is I'm not so sure that punishment is God's choice so much as the consequence of our choice, right?
[00:53:07] And so
[00:53:09] If we choose to cut ourselves off, if we make that choice, to cut ourselves off from the source of life, God's gonna allow that.
[00:53:21] God's gonna allow that.
[00:53:25] And we, when we're cut off from the source of life, we just cease to be.
[00:53:29] That punishment is chosen by us and it's not just a punishment that we choose for a future, it's a punishment that we choose for our life right now.
[00:53:38] It's like this, Wes.
[00:53:40] Belinda Carlisle was right.
[00:53:42] Heaven is a place on earth.
[00:53:44] But so is hell, and that's a whole other song.

[00:53:46] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_07]:
Yeah, that's a whole completely different song.
[00:53:47] That's Iron Maiden.
[00:53:48] That's an Iron Maiden song.
[00:53:49] That's Iron Maiden.

[00:53:50] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Hell on earth.
[00:53:50] Okay.
[00:53:51] So if hell is separation, so when you think about sort of theologically speaking, hell ultimately really is separation from God.
[00:54:01] That's what hell is.
[00:54:03] If you want to know what hell is in this life, it is to be separated from God.
[00:54:09] And when we, the thing that does the separating of us from God is our sin.
[00:54:15] Right?
[00:54:16] It's all the things that we do.
[00:54:17] And that happens in our earthly life ever so much more than it happens, friends, in the life that is to come.
[00:54:23] So if we choose to live under the dominion of sin, if we choose to continue to feed those desires within us and separate from God in this life, there's pain associated with it.
[00:54:35] There just is.
[00:54:36] And in the end, the whole annihilation thing comes up.
[00:54:40] We just cease to exist.
[00:54:42] And God wants to be in redeemed relationship with us not just then, but now.
[00:54:49] God's not just interested in the rest of everything, but in the here and now and how we're living in the here and now.

[00:54:56] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Right, so what does it look like for us as Christians in our day-to-day lives to stay connected to the vine?
[00:55:04] Kind of what's that motivational... Well, it isn't fear.

[00:55:06] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
It's not like this is all fire insurance, right?
[00:55:08] Which is what y'all were told.
[00:55:10] You need to get some fire insurance, right?
[00:55:12] Those of you who are Baptists know what I'm talking about.
[00:55:14] Anyway...
[00:55:17] We don't choose that because we're scared.
[00:55:21] We choose it because it's where life is.
[00:55:23] And this is what I want you to know.
[00:55:24] It is good to know Jesus.
[00:55:29] Every good thing I have ever experienced was because I knew Jesus.
[00:55:37] Every moment where there was something, some baggage I was carrying from my childhood or past relationships or things that I'd done that I wish I hadn't done, every piece that I made with that came because of Jesus.
[00:55:51] Because I turned and I let Jesus heal those things in me.
[00:55:54] Every good, abundant, hopeful, peaceful, directed, loving, stable, steady thing in my life has come because of Jesus.
[00:56:04] And when I talk to friends that I know that don't have that connection, I have an ache for them because I want them to know what I have known in Jesus.
[00:56:15] That when the terrible things happen, and y'all, terrible things happen.
[00:56:20] They just do.
[00:56:23] The thing that has given me hope has been Jesus.
[00:56:27] And Jesus says in that passage about I'm the vine, he says, I'm the vine, you're the vine.
[00:56:32] And he says, you remain in me by obeying my commandments.
[00:56:36] And then he tells us, and we go, oh crap, which ones?
[00:56:38] We better start making a checklist, right?
[00:56:40] Because that's how we treat that.
[00:56:41] And then he straight up tells us what commandment we're supposed to follow.
[00:56:44] You know what it is?
[00:56:45] Love one another.
[00:56:48] And if we love one another, if we let that love of God flow through us, that's called fruit, right?
[00:56:54] So, xylem up the love of God, right?
[00:56:58] And we bear fruit.
[00:57:00] And that fruit is the fruit of love.
[00:57:03] It's good to know because the only way to really live and produce fruit is to thrive is to do that in Jesus.
[00:57:09] And I want you to think about it this way.
[00:57:10] Go back to last week.
[00:57:12] Wes talked about how Jesus was able to be obedient and faithful in a way that we can't be.
[00:57:16] And that his obedience and his faithfulness to choose the way for our redemption happened because, go back to Gethsemane, it happened because life flowed through him from God and he knew it.
[00:57:33] And so Pilate couldn't do anything to him because he knew where life was coming from within him.
[00:57:39] So friends, our obedience, our faithfulness, those emerge from the same place.
[00:57:42] They don't save us, but they connect us to God.
[00:57:45] And they give us strength for the living of our days.
[00:57:49] So here's the deal.
[00:57:50] I'm not prepared to say that people that don't profess the name of Jesus are going to hell.
[00:57:56] That's not our call.
[00:57:59] It's just not.
[00:58:00] And so long as that's what we're worried about, we're kind of missing the point of this whole heaven and hell thing anyway.
[00:58:06] It's not our call.
[00:58:08] We are saved by our faith, not by our works, but by the grace of God and the faithfulness of Jesus on the cross.
[00:58:15] However, I will say that knowing Jesus and living like Jesus teaches us is life-giving.
[00:58:26] It is life-giving in the here and now.
[00:58:29] And every good work, every fruit in our life flows out of that relationship, out of our connection to the vine.
[00:58:37] And so we stay connected to the vine and we seek nourishment and we seek life and we do that in lots of ways, right?
[00:58:44] We do that when we study the Bible and we do that when we pray and we do that when we have devotions and we do it when we worship and we do it when we go serve other people and we do it in the way that we remain connected in community with other people so that they can help us.
[00:58:57] And sometimes there's going to be pruning because he talks about that too, right?
[00:59:01] But God doesn't prune to destroy, God prunes to bring more growth.
[00:59:08] God doesn't prune us to send us to hell.
[00:59:10] God prunes us so that we might live.
[00:59:14] And so all of that happens, and sometimes that happens in Bible studies and sometimes it happens in relationships and the person that can say to you, hey, I just wanna maybe point out that you're not living like somebody who's finding their life in Jesus.
[00:59:29] So we pray that we might do that, not so that we would be saved at some future point down the road,
[00:59:38] But so that we might know salvation in the here and now.
[00:59:42] Right?
[00:59:43] Salvation, there's this, talk for me a second, oh Greek scholar, about the aorist tense.
[00:59:51] Just dumb it down for us plebes down here that don't really know.

[00:59:57] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Past tense, but if I remember correctly, past tense, that's still happening.

[01:00:03] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
So it started happening in the past, and it's continuing in the future, right?
[01:00:07] So God has saved us.
[01:00:09] We are continuing to be saved.

[01:00:11] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_07]:
We are being saved.

[01:00:11] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
We are continually being saved.
[01:00:13] We are continually becoming what God has called us to be.
[01:00:17] We are continually living in God.
[01:00:18] So God has already done the saving.
[01:00:21] We are continuing to live into that.
[01:00:23] and that's what our whole life is it's not just something that happens in the future it's something that has already happened is happening and will happen which makes me think of i am what i was i am what i will be i am who i am all right so god that is the nature of god and god is always saving us past present and future
[01:00:43] So we do that, and we pray that we might do that, not so that we'll be saved then, but so that we can know salvation now, and not so that we can lord it over and judge other people in the living of our days now, but so that we can show people where the living water is.
[01:00:59] So that we can show people how they get connected to the vine.

[01:01:02] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
Jump into the river, like I said last week.

[01:01:03] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Jump into the river.
[01:01:04] So that we can jump into the river and we can let that nutrient flow through us so that it might be fruit for somebody else so that they can get connected to the vine and they can know what we have found in Jesus.
[01:01:14] Not because we're afraid, but because we know it's life.
[01:01:18] And it's life in abundance.
[01:01:22] So who's going to be saved?

[01:01:23] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_00]:
It's God's business.

[01:01:25] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
It's God's business.
[01:01:26] But we need to make a decision.
[01:01:30] Okay, we didn't answer all your questions and I know it, right?
[01:01:36] You still got questions?
[01:01:37] You probably have questions coming out of this.

[01:01:39] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_07]:
I'm gonna direct all your questions to Wesley.
[01:01:42] Hey, I don't remember making any promises, by the way.

[01:01:48] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_08]:
Living as a Christian, friends, means living with mystery.
[01:01:54] You gotta be okay with what we don't know.
[01:01:57] and with making our best guess and then trying to believe as faithfully as we can live in light of our very best guess and trusting that at the end of the day you know what's gonna save you and ain't your best guess it's gonna be Jesus and Jesus alone so I want us to take a minute and pray so I want you to think for a second just close your eyes and open your hands in front of you and in your hands I want you to think about holding someone
[01:02:23] You can be holding yourself, that's okay.
[01:02:25] You can be holding someone you know who has walked away from their faith of late.
[01:02:31] You could be holding someone who you know has never heard and doesn't know about the goodness of Jesus Christ.
[01:02:38] I want you to think about these people, folks that are going through the worst thing you ever went through and they're doing it without Jesus.
[01:02:46] And I want you to just hold them in your hand.
[01:02:50] and here's what I want you to do you're not holding them because you're not the Savior either I want you just ever so slightly to lift your hands up and I want you to think about holding that person into the light of God's love for them because you got to know friends that God's love for other people is bigger than our love for them and let's just take a minute to pray God we bring this person we bring ourselves and we put ourselves into the light of your love
[01:03:23] We put this person into the light of your love and we pray God for them.
[01:03:28] Lord, every good thing we ever had came because we knew you.
[01:03:32] Every life-giving moment of right decision-making or good discernment, every loving, hopeful, faithful thing happened because you are so good and your life is the only way to truly know any kind of life in this life.
[01:03:54] And so God we pray for those who have not yet known the goodness of being connected into the vine.
[01:04:02] For those who feel like they are maybe headed for Gehenna.
[01:04:09] Those people that are scared and afraid and
[01:04:12] Thinking that your desire is for their destruction because they've just been so terrible that they need to be cut off forever.
[01:04:19] God, we don't believe that you want any of us to be cut off forever.
[01:04:23] You long for us to be connected to you.
[01:04:25] You long to be in relationship with us.
[01:04:29] And so God, we pray for those who have not yet known, those who have not yet heard, those who have heard but the worries of this life have choked it out.
[01:04:39] Those who have heard and believed but that has been just pulled away from them by the circumstances that they are experiencing.
[01:04:49] And we pray God that you might allow us to share the good news of life with them.
[01:04:55] That we would be so rooted and connected into you that your life would be flowing through us just as surely as the water and the nutrients flow up from the roots.
[01:05:05] And Lord that the life that you are producing in us might nourish the wholeness of those who are around us.
[01:05:13] That we might be helping other people to know about the goodness we have found in you.
[01:05:18] We pray God for the salvation of the world.
[01:05:23] Not because we're scared or because we think that everybody just gets to go without any kind of decision on their part, but because we really truly want everybody to know what we have found in you.
[01:05:36] You are life.
[01:05:38] You are hope.
[01:05:38] You are peace.
[01:05:40] you are our strength when we are weary you are the ones that hear us our voice and our call for mercy who sets our feet upon a rock when we feel like we are on the sinking sand you are the one God who shows us the way that leads to life you are the one who has rescued us you are the one who has healed us and set us free you are the one God that gives us life and we want other people to know it too God because you are so good
[01:06:09] So thank you Jesus for being so good and help us Lord to bear witness to you that the whole world may be saved.
[01:06:17] Help us to lift you up in everything that we do and we pray God that your promise is true that when you but be lifted up you will draw all people to yourself.
[01:06:28] We ask it Lord not in the strength of our faith but on the faithfulness of Jesus.
[01:06:34] We ask it Lord not confident in ourselves but confident in you.
[01:06:39] We ask because we know that you are the Lord and you are the one that reigns.
[01:06:45] Hear our prayer, Lord, we pray in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ.
[01:06:49] Amen.
[01:06:51] Friends, we give thanks for all the goodness of God and we're getting ready to sing a song called What He's Done.
[01:06:55] Man, what Jesus has done for you is so good, don't ever forget it.
[01:06:59] So let's sing to the glory of God about it.

[01:07:02] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_05]:
Will you stand and sing with us?

[01:07:12] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_01]:
Hey there and good morning!

[01:07:18] [SPEAKER SPEAKER_06]:
So glad you joined us for worship this morning.
[01:07:21] I'm curious if you're enjoying these conversations about tough questions.
[01:07:26] Have we hit a question that you've asked before that you've been like, oh, I'm so glad they're talking about this?
[01:07:32] Or maybe it was your question on the Minty poll that we're tackling.
[01:07:36] So either way, I hope that what we're talking about is intriguing to you and is encouraging you to dig into the Scripture yourself.
[01:07:45] Because I think that's what these questions tend to do.
[01:07:47] They tend to cue up our curiosity and make us go, huh.
[01:07:53] Well, let me read more about that.
[01:07:55] Let me explore that more.
[01:07:57] And, you know, like we talked about the very first Sunday we were doing this sermon series, sometimes I don't know is an answer.
[01:08:06] Sometimes it's supposed to be a mystery, right?
[01:08:08] Sometimes
[01:08:09] We really don't know all the answers and I think today's question really kind of hit upon the fact that we really don't know a solid answer to it but it's a great conversation to have and I'm really glad that you're joining us for that and yet again great invitation for you guys to be here in person if you live in the local area if you're kind of checking out churches hey we'd love to have you we worship at 9 30 and at 11 o'clock on Sunday mornings and we are at 575 Brawley School Road check us out in person sometime okay I'm gonna close this out oh wait I have
[01:08:39] We have an announcement.
[01:08:41] Next Sunday, and you're gonna get a gold star if you remember this, next Sunday we have one worship service.
[01:08:47] One service at 10 a.m.
[01:08:51] 1 service at 10 so if you're watching us online next week make sure you tune in at 10 o'clock and not at 9 30. okay so next sunday is a fifth sunday and on fifth sundays we have one service at 10 o'clock if you're in town we always have a lot of fun on fifth sunday so if you're here we'd love to see you i want to close us out with a benediction today and and kind of tackle this um really kind of invite
[01:09:18] God to give us peace with the fact that sometimes we're not going to know.
[01:09:22] We just won't know the answer, right?
[01:09:24] So here's our benediction for today.
[01:09:28] May God continue to make us more comfortable with not knowing.
[01:09:34] Because what we do know is the important part, right?
[01:09:37] We know that our God is love.
[01:09:41] And we know that God came to be with us through His Son, Jesus Christ.
[01:09:45] that's where our faith stands we lean into what we know and we find ways to be comfortable with what we don't know and may God help us find that comfort because sometimes it is hard to be uncomfortable with the unknown but hey great questions guys okay I hope you have a great week remember next Sunday fifth Sunday one service at 10 a.m. and I really do hope I see you there